I'm about to set up two Linux PCs for the Alcott Arts Center (www.alcottartscenter.org) in KCK. One Linux PC will be running Edubuntu, and most of Project Gutenberg, for their library; another one will have regular Ubuntu or Kubuntu to be run in their office.
These folks are so financially-strapped that the Center doesn't even have a phone turned on (the wires are there but the phone connection isn't active), let alone a broadband Internet connection. The "Alcott Arts Center" phone is actually a second line in the caretaker's house a block away. I've already booted up the laptop and determined there are no nearby WiFi hotspots.
I'll run the updates before I pack up the PCs, but after I install them on-site there is no on-site method of downloading updates. Is there a way to give an Ubuntu update repository a list of installed software on another computer, and thus download updates for another system to be transferred to that system via memory key or even CD/DVD? I'll continue to have personal access to both PCs for maintenance.
On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 12:13 AM, Leo Mauler [email protected] wrote:
I'll run the updates before I pack up the PCs, but after I install them on-site there is no on-site method of downloading updates. Is there a way to give an Ubuntu update repository a list of installed software on another computer, and thus download updates for another system to be transferred to that system via memory key or even CD/DVD? I'll continue to have personal access to both PCs for maintenance.
Someone did start this idea: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OfflineUpdateSpec But, I'm fairly sure you can drop the .deb packages on a CD or something and just copy them over, like this: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=342865
Jon.
--- On Sat, 5/31/08, Jon Pruente [email protected] wrote:
On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 12:13 AM, Leo Mauler [email protected] wrote:
I'll run the updates before I pack up the PCs, but after I install them on-site there is no on-site method of downloading updates. Is there a way to give an Ubuntu update repository a list of installed software on another computer, and thus download updates for another system to be transferred to that system via memory key or even CD/DVD? I'll continue to have personal access to both PCs for maintenance.
Someone did start this idea: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OfflineUpdateSpec But, I'm fairly sure you can drop the .deb packages on a CD or something and just copy them over, like this: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=342865
Back in 2006 someone at Ubuntu added a nifty feature to Synaptic Package Manager, which allows you to pick out packages you want to install using the offline machine's Synaptic Package Manager, then instead of selecting "Apply" you go into the menus and select "Generate Package Download Script". This creates "ubuntu.sh" which is a series of wget commands, which you run on a machine with Internet access. I think the assumption is that somehow you have *some* form of slow Internet on the offline machine, in order to get new package lists from the repositories.
Full description of this feature: http://beans.seartipy.com/2006/11/03/simple-way-to-update-ubuntu-edgy-with-s...
TinyURL: http://tinyurl.com/3rk4qk
However, there's no way as yet to do the same thing with the security updates, and the difficulty with security updates is that you frequently don't need all of them (since very few people install ALL of the software packages), but you do need some of them the instant they are available.
Is there some way to download all of the security updates since N days ago? At this point I wouldn't mind having to put all of them on a few CDs, every now and then, just to get them on-site.
On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 12:13 AM, Leo Mauler [email protected] wrote:
These folks are so financially-strapped that the Center doesn't even have a phone turned on (the wires are there but the phone connection isn't active), let alone a broadband Internet connection.
So if a security vulnerability that is resolved by an update, you won't have the means to easily, and automatically, patch it before someone exploits that vulnerability on their server.
As soon as someone figures out how to exploit a computer that isn't connected to the Internet, that is.
--- On Sat, 5/31/08, Monty J. Harder [email protected] wrote:
On Sat, May 31, 2008 at 12:13 AM, Leo Mauler [email protected] wrote:
These folks are so financially-strapped that the Center doesn't even have a phone turned on (the wires are there but the phone connection isn't active), let alone a broadband Internet connection.
So if a security vulnerability that is resolved by an update, you won't have the means to easily, and automatically, patch it before someone exploits that vulnerability on their server.
As soon as someone figures out how to exploit a computer that isn't connected to the Internet, that is.
Oddly enough it turns out that I've run into a technician's mixed blessing: a poor non-profit full of people who have wanted technology for six years. Once I pointed out that some of the systems they have in their "donation storage room" could be used as servers, they came clean with a number of ideas and expressed the desire to add Internet to the building now that they have an actual technical person interested in volunteering time and effort.
Among their ideas (which they described using considerably less technical words): security camera footage being transmitted via the Internet to the caretaker's house; live webcam photos/video of art classes in session; WiFi hotspot for the arts center lounge; and a few other ideas. They even have everything needed for a recording studio, though I've had a look at the equipment and I think they need a sound engineer in to take a look at the recording equipment donated by a local radio station.
There's not a lot of funding for these ideas, so we may end up actually implementing the WiFi VPN WAN using sheet metal parabolic dish antennas that I mentioned as a "possibility". There's a spot at the edge of the property nearest to the caretaker to put in a passive WiFi repeater on a permanent pole, to strengthen the signal.
On Saturday 31 May 2008 00:13:44 Leo Mauler wrote:
I'm about to set up two Linux PCs for the Alcott Arts Center
I'll run the updates before I pack up the PCs, but after I install them on-site there is no on-site method of downloading updates.
We all love to have the latest and greatest software, but why would you really need to run regular updates? The system is not exposed to internet hacking, so security updates aren't really needed, and as long as it works, it doesn't need anything.
Without automatic updates, what, is he supposed to go down there himself to break ALSA or Xorg? How's he supposed to have seemingly random problems occur without provocation?
On Sun, Jun 1, 2008 at 10:20 AM, Jonathan Hutchins [email protected] wrote:
but why would you really need to run regular updates? The system is not exposed to internet hacking, so security updates aren't really needed, and as long as it works, it doesn't need anything.
--- On Sun, 6/1/08, Jonathan Hutchins [email protected] wrote:
On Saturday 31 May 2008 00:13:44 Leo Mauler wrote:
I'm about to set up two Linux PCs for the Alcott Arts Center
I'll run the updates before I pack up the PCs, but after I install them on-site there is no on-site method of downloading updates.
We all love to have the latest and greatest software, but why would you really need to run regular updates? The system is not exposed to internet hacking, so security updates aren't really needed, and as long as it works, it doesn't need anything.
How about because I want to get them used to the idea of regular updates, in particular security updates?
These folks aren't Internet-free because they want to be Internet free, they're Internet-free because the money isn't there yet. Now that a technical person (me) is available and willing to put in volunteer hours to add computers to their art center, they've already started looking into obtaining funding for Internet service. Its just a matter of time before their arts center computers become "exposed to internet hacking."
If I just slack off from the start, then by the time they need updates there will be no regular schedule in place to perform the updates. And if you've ever tech-supported a non-technical person, you know that getting them onto a regular schedule of computer maintenance takes a lot of time and effort.
On Mon, Jun 2, 2008 at 5:42 AM, Leo Mauler [email protected] wrote:
How about because I want to get them used to the idea of regular updates, in particular security updates?
These folks aren't Internet-free because they want to be Internet free, they're Internet-free because the money isn't there yet. Now that a technical person (me) is available and willing to put in volunteer hours to add computers to their art center, they've already started looking into obtaining funding for Internet service. Its just a matter of time before their arts center computers become "exposed to internet hacking."
And when you connect these computers to the Internet, you'll be able to do updates easily. Explain to them that the need for security updates isn't significant while they're not connected, but that fortunately, being connected also makes doing the updates really easy. As a tech-support person, I know all about bad habits that users get into, so I would even put it in writing, and make them sign it.
But if you think there's a good chance they'll have the Internet soon, try to time the install so that you can skip that step, and just show them how to do online updates.
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Billy Crook -
Jon Pruente -
Jonathan Hutchins -
Leo Mauler -
Luke -Jr -
Monty J. Harder